Filmmaker Ian Ebright’s terrific directorial debut, The Way We Speak, stars Patrick Fabian as Simon, a writer who, along with his cancer-stricken wife (Diana Coconubo), travels to a conference to debate a long-time friend. But when the friend suffers a heart attack, the organizers substitute him for Sarah, (Kailey Rhodes), a bestselling Christian author. Fabian, known for his role in Better Call Saul, brings his seasoned expertise to the project, while Rhodes and Coconubo deliver remarkable performances in their first major film roles.
In this interview, the cast and director talk about the film and their experience collaborating with Ebright. They touch on the intense debate scenes, the actors’ preparation, and the organic development of their characters. This interview has been edited for length and clarity.
Ian, this is your first feature. How did this come about, and how did you get this great cast?
Ian Ebright: I mean, I have to say, it’s a lot of notable firsts, so thank you for acknowledging mine. It was also our director of photography, AJ Marson, his first. We have the seasoned person that we were so lucky to get in, Patrick, and then on the opposite ends, it’s Kailey’s first major film role, and Diana has certainly done things, but Diana, am I right that this was also your first co-leading role in a feature?
Diana Coconubo: Yes, correct. Yeah.
You shot this in 18 days?
Ian Ebright: Yeah, which is officially three days too short. I mean, it was stupid. There’s never enough money on indie films, and so you feel the budget but having these actors and the rapport that we had as a team didn’t just save the film in terms of capturing great stuff that worked, but it helped us make our days because we did not have the time that we needed.
And as smart as I thought I was writing re-occurring locations, we still had a dozen or so, so we were kind of all over the city. So, we were moving at a clip.
Patrick, I imagine you’re sort of used to filming things fast from doing a lot of TV, but did you guys have any rehearsal time on this?
Patrick Fabian: Not rehearsal per se the way you think, “Oh, we’re going to take five days off and do theater games with one another.” No. But the good news is that I’ve got Kailey and Diana beside me, and what they were was they were game. They were game to play in the moment, and a film like this with words like this and speed and budget like this, it’s so important because they came with their homework, right? And when you do that, then you can play, and when you play, you find things that all of a sudden, the script maybe didn’t seem like it had. And then Ian can say, “I like that, but that thing that’s percolating, let’s drive down that, and let’s do this and that.” That’s the exciting part of it.
The non-exciting part is the poor UPM who’s over Ian’s shoulder saying, “that’s really nice that you’re making magic in a cup, but we’ve got to wrap up by midnight.” That was the challenge.
But the fun part was doing it, and I think all of us, I’ll speak for all of us, I think, yeah, we got tired, the days were long and fast, but when that thing is happening, when the juice is flowing, that’s what you signed up for.
I want to ask about those debate scenes. They’re so integral to the story in the film, but I’ve seen scenes like that before, and you’re thinking, “All right, let’s just get on with the story.” But here, I was just so enjoying the back and forth between you and Kailey. How did you guys get the right tone for those scenes?
Kailey Rhodes: The gold medal goes to the editing. We were up there saying it, and I was like, “this is like a lot, this is a lot.” Then the editing, like that interstitial back and forth, it’s with your heartbeat. Your heart’s beating faster because the clips are changing, and it’s really beautifully done.
I got the privilege of watching it in a theater for the first time, and I was completely enthralled with those scenes, and I agree with you that I was like, “I’m not sure how that’s going to play,” and it punches. It’s awesome.
Diana, your scene at the very end, when your kind of telling him off. I kind of expected you to rage out but you were so calm and measured, making it that much more powerful. How did you decide to keep it that way as opposed to chewing up the scenery?
Diana Coconubo: I think it was likely Ian’s help and figuring out really where Claire is coming from, and her thought processes, and what she’s willing to fight for, and maybe just understanding what she’s not willing to fight for. Personally, I’d probably be much more aggressive, but it just felt right, I suppose, in the moments.
I think playing off each other, and really listening… as actors, we’re always really taught to listen, just listen. What are you getting? What are you hearing? What are they doing? How is it making you feel? Really going through those in the moment. I can probably lie and say like, “Oh, that was all very planned and strategic,” and of course, I had done the work, but those choices sort of happened organically.
Patrick, along the same line as Diana’s question, but when you’re debating Kailey and you say those terrible things to her, you also could have just yelled and gone for broke. But the way you said it, it had an even deeper and more terrible impact.
Patrick Fabian: Well, I think it’s the unmasking of his entitlement. That he feels he can unleash that with actually no ramifications. He doesn’t have to shout it. And also, he’s just stating a fact. “Don’t you all get that? I mean, I know it may offend some people, but obviously, right?” I think he’s still in that mindset like, “no, no, people will be on my side after saying this.” I think it’s a bit of a shock to him. It’s the decor above it all.
And then the post scene about that, “I’m not really interested in apologizing except perfunctorily, I can’t even say the word. You know what I’m saying, just because I have to in order to go ahead and get what I want. I’m still eyes on the prize. I don’t see that that was necessarily a bad thing, so I don’t have to scream it because it’s just a fact,” I think is what Simon’s built in with that sort of thing. And it is devastating.
The same respect, going back to Diana and I, in which she delivers that to me, it’s awful. It’s awful because it just sits there as an immutable truth. What he does with it is what he does with it, but it’s awful to be on a receiving end of that.
Ian, this is such a dialogue-heavy film. Were you a stickler for the words?
Ian Ebright: No. Like Diana was saying, we all have our versions of doing our homework and coming prepared. For me, that’s like 50-60 drafts. So, there’s just a point where I’m too close to it. And I’m not David Mamet. I idolized David Mamet. I like Aaron Sorkin. But I don’t know. The real fun for me… there’s like, it’s the edit, it’s the music, and primarily the most important thing that I enjoy is working with actors. So, if I come in and I’m rigid and like, “Here’s the gospel, I’m down from the mountains. Here’s the two tablets, just ingest, people…” I mean, it’s my first feature and I’ve got Patrick Fabian.
There are obviously things that are going to be lacking if I’m not inviting them in, and in my limited experience, I feel that actors really genuinely… You really quickly know the characters better than I do, which is the best kind of humble pie. I’ve been working on this stupid thing for three years, and they come in and just see these things that were obvious to them.
It’s exciting because I don’t feel like I have my footing, but you know that it’s improving in real time. And when you’re with people that you trust… we have found this to be true as the four of us have been talking, I think character and taste become elephants in the room in a good way. That’s a weird analogy. But it’s like, there’s no sort of territorial thing. I guess I would probably lie to you and answer your question differently if there were people that I felt like I had to really go to war against, but with these guys, I always felt like we were in service of the same thing, we were all pointed in the right direction, and that speaks to competence and character and taste, and having some sort of weird shorthand, even though you’re basically strangers.
Patrick, how did this role come to you?
Patrick Fabian: Well, Ian had seen some of my other work. He was a fan of Better Call Saul, which I was on for a few seasons.
I’ve heard of that show.
Patrick Fabian: I think he told me, when he saw Howard in a scene or two, he was like, “Oh my god, that could be Simon.” And he got the script to me, and I read it and I was like, “Oh, I’m interested in this.” We got on the phone, and we hit it off, and it’s like, “let’s go.”
So that’s the old adage of work begets work. That’s why I never turn down hardly any auditions, and you say “yes,” because you show up, because you don’t know who you’re going to meet or who you’re going to run into and what that’s going to lead to. I wouldn’t have the experience of doing The Way We Speak. I wouldn’t have the experience of doing Ian’s first feature, being able to work alongside Kailey, and work alongside Diana, if I hadn’t said “yes” to an audition and got a job.
Those are those crooked lines that all actors have to say like, “Well, how did it happen overnight?” But it didn’t. It happened with all these wonderful sorts of happenstances. And now, the great news is, is that this project bonds us all. It puts us in ember together moving forward, which I love.
